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	<title>Comments on: The Good And Bad Reasons For Anti-Mormonism</title>
	<link>http://larison.org/2007/02/14/the-good-and-bad-reasons-for-anti-mormonism/</link>
	<description>n. the principle of good order "Observe the strange inversion of all order and sense! Dignity debased; how vilely is the function of a consul prostituted!" ~The Craftsman</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 09 Feb 2012 16:39:19 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>by: MDCLXVI</title>
		<link>http://larison.org/2007/02/14/the-good-and-bad-reasons-for-anti-mormonism/#comment-7127</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 01:22:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larison.org/2007/02/14/the-good-and-bad-reasons-for-anti-mormonism/#comment-7127</guid>
					<description>Or rather one way and not the other.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Or rather one way and not the other.
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		<title>by: MDCLXVI</title>
		<link>http://larison.org/2007/02/14/the-good-and-bad-reasons-for-anti-mormonism/#comment-7126</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 29 Jun 2007 01:22:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larison.org/2007/02/14/the-good-and-bad-reasons-for-anti-mormonism/#comment-7126</guid>
					<description>I like Mormonism as a culture, not so much as a religion. Wish there was some way to have it both ways.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like Mormonism as a culture, not so much as a religion. Wish there was some way to have it both ways.
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		<title>by: Ron Guhname</title>
		<link>http://larison.org/2007/02/14/the-good-and-bad-reasons-for-anti-mormonism/#comment-7116</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Jun 2007 01:15:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larison.org/2007/02/14/the-good-and-bad-reasons-for-anti-mormonism/#comment-7116</guid>
					<description>Anyone who knows and understands Mormons realizes that there are no good reasons for anti-Mormonism. This is especially true for a conservative, and it is true for someone like me who cherishes our Christian heritage. Wayward believers are not the enemy. In politics, they should be our allies, and if the most qualified, our leaders.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Anyone who knows and understands Mormons realizes that there are no good reasons for anti-Mormonism. This is especially true for a conservative, and it is true for someone like me who cherishes our Christian heritage. Wayward believers are not the enemy. In politics, they should be our allies, and if the most qualified, our leaders.
</p>
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		<title>by: Christopher Hayes</title>
		<link>http://larison.org/2007/02/14/the-good-and-bad-reasons-for-anti-mormonism/#comment-5715</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Mar 2007 16:42:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larison.org/2007/02/14/the-good-and-bad-reasons-for-anti-mormonism/#comment-5715</guid>
					<description>I've half-written a few comments in this space the past few weeks, but I think I've got my thoughts down to a manageable size now.

What do Mormon's think of other Christians?  Well, we say "You love Jesus Christ?  Great!  So do we.  You have truths that have helped you live good lives?  Great! Come get more!  You want a renewal?  It's here!  The heaven's are open, and God speaks through a Prophet again!"  

Do we discard all the work and wisdom of faithful Christians during the last 2,000 years?  No.  We will, however, contend that there was no Prophet presiding over the matters of God here on Earth.  There have always been faithful followers of Christ, but throughout history, there are times when these followers are led through a Prophet, and times when they are not.  It's a bold claim, and we make no apologies about it.

The Gospel of Jesus Christ holds the answers to todays problems, not only through application of previous revelations, but through current revelation, from God, about the specific and unique issues we face today.  These instructions are not what most would call specifically political.  They are direction on how to live a good life.  These influence political decisions to the extent that politics are involved in what people do (or don't do) in their daily personal lives, and should act as a global anchor and reference point for all decisions.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve half-written a few comments in this space the past few weeks, but I think I&#8217;ve got my thoughts down to a manageable size now.</p>
<p>What do Mormon&#8217;s think of other Christians?  Well, we say &#8220;You love Jesus Christ?  Great!  So do we.  You have truths that have helped you live good lives?  Great! Come get more!  You want a renewal?  It&#8217;s here!  The heaven&#8217;s are open, and God speaks through a Prophet again!&#8221;  </p>
<p>Do we discard all the work and wisdom of faithful Christians during the last 2,000 years?  No.  We will, however, contend that there was no Prophet presiding over the matters of God here on Earth.  There have always been faithful followers of Christ, but throughout history, there are times when these followers are led through a Prophet, and times when they are not.  It&#8217;s a bold claim, and we make no apologies about it.</p>
<p>The Gospel of Jesus Christ holds the answers to todays problems, not only through application of previous revelations, but through current revelation, from God, about the specific and unique issues we face today.  These instructions are not what most would call specifically political.  They are direction on how to live a good life.  These influence political decisions to the extent that politics are involved in what people do (or don&#8217;t do) in their daily personal lives, and should act as a global anchor and reference point for all decisions.
</p>
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		<title>by: Daniel Larison</title>
		<link>http://larison.org/2007/02/14/the-good-and-bad-reasons-for-anti-mormonism/#comment-5582</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Feb 2007 02:38:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larison.org/2007/02/14/the-good-and-bad-reasons-for-anti-mormonism/#comment-5582</guid>
					<description>Thanks, Prof. Fox, for your comment and the very interesting post.  Thanks also for the kind remarks about me in the post.  I will try to write a reply to your post soon.  I appreciated your insights, and I would be glad to have someone explain in some greater detail what Mormons think of other Christians, if I have misstated or poorly stated the case.  If I have significantly misunderstood this, I would be very glad to know it.

I have been pondering why Romney has won as much support among activists as he has, and I think it does go a long way towards the same trend that I noticed in another post on the role of religion in the conservative movement.  Back then I &lt;a href="http://larison.org/2007/01/15/wheres-all-this-religion-in-conservatism-we-keep-hearing-about/" rel="nofollow"&gt;wrote&lt;/a&gt;:

"When Cal Thomas started singing the praises of secular modernity after 9/11 (as if to show you that he was no religious fanatic like those people), you could take it as a given that religion, and specifically the great significance attached to Christianity even by some old Moral Majority hands like Thomas, was potentially expendable for a lot of conservatives when supposedly more important things (such as the fight against “medievalism” and for “women’s rights” and “tolerance”) were at stake.  In the end, I don’t see that much modern conservative reliance on religion.  The “movement” certainly relies on religious people to keep it running with their support, financial and otherwise, and to that end they have to say nice things about the value of religion now and again (and I assume most honestly believe these things when they say them), but do they “lean heavily” on religion “to the exclusion” of nonbelievers?  Quite simply, no, they don’t."   

As far as the activists who are backing Romney today go, I take it as more or less a given that their support for him vindicates this interpretation of the importance of religion, specifically Christianity, for a lot of the movement's "movers and shakers."  That is, it is useful in certain cases, but it will not serve as an obstacle to other goals.  What remains to be seen, and what I think will end up surprising a lot of these activists, is just how different the mass of Christian conservatives is from the activists in the movement and the party. I assume that the difference is still rather large.  

The activist approach to '08 is something like, "Just win, baby."  Thus you see people willing to tie themselves into knots to find some way to explain Giuliani as a plausible candidate and pretend that people will rally around Romney because he has "good values."  The Christian conservative voters, on the other hand, work on the assumption that they back the movement and party because it advances their worldview--it is not supposed to be an alliance into which they entered to make such fundamental compromises, but it is supposed to be a vehicle for bringing their convictions into the political arena.  To ask them to look past things in these candidates that are at odds with the basic reasons why they are involved in politics in the first place just seems bound to fail.  Religious conservatives have been had too many times to keep falling for the old spiel that says, "He shares your values."  I'm not sure what it says about a movement that is willing to so thoroughly compromise on key elements of its identity, but it can't be an encouraging sign for that movement's future health.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, Prof. Fox, for your comment and the very interesting post.  Thanks also for the kind remarks about me in the post.  I will try to write a reply to your post soon.  I appreciated your insights, and I would be glad to have someone explain in some greater detail what Mormons think of other Christians, if I have misstated or poorly stated the case.  If I have significantly misunderstood this, I would be very glad to know it.</p>
<p>I have been pondering why Romney has won as much support among activists as he has, and I think it does go a long way towards the same trend that I noticed in another post on the role of religion in the conservative movement.  Back then I <a href="http://larison.org/2007/01/15/wheres-all-this-religion-in-conservatism-we-keep-hearing-about/" rel="nofollow">wrote</a>:</p>
<p>&#8220;When Cal Thomas started singing the praises of secular modernity after 9/11 (as if to show you that he was no religious fanatic like those people), you could take it as a given that religion, and specifically the great significance attached to Christianity even by some old Moral Majority hands like Thomas, was potentially expendable for a lot of conservatives when supposedly more important things (such as the fight against “medievalism” and for “women’s rights” and “tolerance”) were at stake.  In the end, I don’t see that much modern conservative reliance on religion.  The “movement” certainly relies on religious people to keep it running with their support, financial and otherwise, and to that end they have to say nice things about the value of religion now and again (and I assume most honestly believe these things when they say them), but do they “lean heavily” on religion “to the exclusion” of nonbelievers?  Quite simply, no, they don’t.&#8221;   </p>
<p>As far as the activists who are backing Romney today go, I take it as more or less a given that their support for him vindicates this interpretation of the importance of religion, specifically Christianity, for a lot of the movement&#8217;s &#8220;movers and shakers.&#8221;  That is, it is useful in certain cases, but it will not serve as an obstacle to other goals.  What remains to be seen, and what I think will end up surprising a lot of these activists, is just how different the mass of Christian conservatives is from the activists in the movement and the party. I assume that the difference is still rather large.  </p>
<p>The activist approach to &#8216;08 is something like, &#8220;Just win, baby.&#8221;  Thus you see people willing to tie themselves into knots to find some way to explain Giuliani as a plausible candidate and pretend that people will rally around Romney because he has &#8220;good values.&#8221;  The Christian conservative voters, on the other hand, work on the assumption that they back the movement and party because it advances their worldview&#8211;it is not supposed to be an alliance into which they entered to make such fundamental compromises, but it is supposed to be a vehicle for bringing their convictions into the political arena.  To ask them to look past things in these candidates that are at odds with the basic reasons why they are involved in politics in the first place just seems bound to fail.  Religious conservatives have been had too many times to keep falling for the old spiel that says, &#8220;He shares your values.&#8221;  I&#8217;m not sure what it says about a movement that is willing to so thoroughly compromise on key elements of its identity, but it can&#8217;t be an encouraging sign for that movement&#8217;s future health.
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		<title>by: Russell Arben Fox</title>
		<link>http://larison.org/2007/02/14/the-good-and-bad-reasons-for-anti-mormonism/#comment-5581</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Feb 2007 01:13:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://larison.org/2007/02/14/the-good-and-bad-reasons-for-anti-mormonism/#comment-5581</guid>
					<description>Daniel's thoughts about the hesitations that paleoconservatives like himself have about Romney prompted some further thoughts from me &lt;a href="http://inmedias.blogspot.com/2007/02/romney-and-paleotheoconservative-test.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;here&lt;/a&gt;. As a Mormon who is, I hope, conscious of the philosophical and theological challenges my faith poses, I've thought a lot about these sort of questions. But then, I also think certain conservatives need to think about what it means that Romney has as much appeal as he already has.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Daniel&#8217;s thoughts about the hesitations that paleoconservatives like himself have about Romney prompted some further thoughts from me <a href="http://inmedias.blogspot.com/2007/02/romney-and-paleotheoconservative-test.html" rel="nofollow">here</a>. As a Mormon who is, I hope, conscious of the philosophical and theological challenges my faith poses, I&#8217;ve thought a lot about these sort of questions. But then, I also think certain conservatives need to think about what it means that Romney has as much appeal as he already has.
</p>
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